PRE-BIRTH EXPERIENCE: Life Before Birth, The Spirit of God, Choice & The Veil

Hello, passionate listeners and watchers! Welcome to Passion Harvest. Thank you so much for being here, wherever you are in the world. I'm Luisa, your host, International Passion Ambassador. I'm so excited about my guest today, Christian Sundberg. If you don't know who he is, Christian Sundberg remembered his existence before coming to Earth.

This pre-birth memory left him completely after childhood and spontaneously returned 10 years ago when Christian took up a meditation practice and experienced a personal awakening journey. While remembering pre-birth memories, Christian began to have out-of-body experiences (OBEs). Christian is the author of the upcoming book A Walk in the Physical, exploring the largest spiritual context in which we exist and the importance of love on our human journey. This is his story, and this is his passion.

Christian, welcome to Passion Harvest. I'm so excited to finally have you on the show. Welcome!

Christian Sundberg:
Thank you. I guess I'll dive right in. Before I start, I just want to say that what I'm going to attempt to talk about is beyond language. It's just not speakable because our higher natures—what we really are and where we come from, the higher realms—are so vastly beyond anything that can be said with our local language. You know, the language we use on Earth is form symbols, and what we really are transcends form, transcends the form of this world. So there's nothing I can say to successfully articulate this, but I'll give it a shot.

Okay, so when I was a small child, I remembered existing before I had been human, and nobody else really spoke about it, so I didn't either. I used to draw on the memories that I'd come with early in my life as a way to kind of peek ahead and see what to expect. And then, as I got older, those memories left me. Certainly, by the age of six or seven, I had no memory after that. So for all of my early adult life, I had no recollection of this at all.

Then, about 10 years ago, when I was 30 (my body is 40 now), I began a long-term meditation practice, and as I meditated, I found that these memories spontaneously returned. And when they returned, it was just like, "Oh my gosh, how did I ever forget that?" It was the most natural thing in the world. I couldn't believe that I had forgotten. And then also, I began to have non-physical experiences, out-of-body experiences, and they were extremely eye-opening, very in-my-face, and my worldview quickly changed, especially as I remembered what I'm doing here.

Okay, so I'll start at what I would call the beginning of the memory that's here for me, but there is not really—I can't really speak well to the order because, while there is a sequence to these memories, they all also feel like they're happening simultaneously, all at once, like now, not even in the past. They're right now too. So I don't know exactly how to speak to that.

Okay, so long ago, before I had ever been physical, I remember coming across a being who had been physical. And when I came across him, I was absolutely inspired by the quality of his nature, the quality of what he was. And I asked him—and again, this isn't words; this is all telepathic communication. It was just an exchange of feeling and information. I asked him, "My goodness, look at you. Are you really like, do you really feel as free and powerful and bright and full of joy and everything that I feel from you?" And he said, "Yes," and he shared it.

And I couldn't believe it, and I said, "Well, what did you do to be this? What could you possibly do for this?" And he described that he had lived physical lives—I won't say human—he had lived physical lives, and I don't know what he was, but he shared one in particular in which he suffered a physical ailment, a pain of some kind, that was with him for many years. And it was an extreme difficulty for him, and how he chose to meet that experience allowed a certain refinement of who he was, of his being.

And I was completely blown away, and I asked him, "Were you healed?" You know, because I could feel how deep this injury had been for him in his life. And he shared, "Yes." He shared the depth of his healing. I could feel how his being had been healed since the physical life. And I was so inspired, and I said, "I want to do that. I'm going to do that. I am going to do that." I was just very definitive.

And not brushing me off, but he kind of said, "Well, that's what they all say." And I was persistent. I said, "No, I mean it. I want to do this. I'm going to be physical." And he said, "Well, it's hard in a way that you've never known before." And it was a very real communication effect, and I said, "I'm okay with that." He said, "Well, go talk to your guides." So I did.

And I don't remember right after that, but I remember going back and finding this being much later after I had lived many lives and sharing with him some of what I had done. And I said, "See, I'm in the process of doing this. I'm not all the way there yet, but I'm doing this." And he was encouraging, but I knew it wasn't done yet.

So okay, now I'm going to fast forward a bit because okay, so there was activity between there—a lot of it I don't remember—but most of the memory that I have is about a time immediately preceding this life or somewhat immediately, where I had lived several lives, and I was taking a very long break in between. I just decided I was taking a long break. I wasn't doing this for a long time. I was just taking a break from the physical thing.

And I remember this guide coming to me every so often and saying, "Are you ready to go back yet? Are you ready to go back yet?" And I kept putting him off for a while, and eventually, I agreed, "Okay, I'm ready to go back."

And I remember meeting with this guide and reviewing with him what I can only describe as my state—who I am, who I had been, what I was. And it was very obvious the thing that I needed to do or to work on in my next incarnation. It was like, not quite like this, but it's just a metaphor, but it's like if you look at a chart or something, it was like there was one part that was just glaring, like, "Oh yeah, I really need to do something about that."

And it was a fear that I had experienced in a past life that had bested me in that past life. And what I mean is, this fear had taken a life of its own in this previous life and led me down a path which made me a very nasty person in that life. I was a very destructive individual, and I ended up dying an agonizing death in that life because of this fear.

And so, subsequently, now I could see that that was a part of me, and so I wanted to re-engage that fear—not because I had to or something, but because I knew that if I could re-engage this fear and if I could integrate it, then there would be a profound expansion of being, an expansion of joy and love, and it would just be unfathomably beautiful.

But I also could see even then that the depth of this fear was so extreme in a certain vibrational way. It was just so extreme that I remember asking the guide, "Is it even possible? Has it ever been done? Has anything this extreme in this way ever been done at all?" And he said, "Yes, and you have all time available to you to do so. There's no hurry."

And I knew with confidence, if it can be done, I can do it. If it is possible at all, then I will do it. And so, they brought me a life that was perfect for this intention to re-engage this low vibration. And I reviewed that life, and I accepted it, and I accepted the veil—the veil of forgetfulness—which is the thing I remember most about this memory.

This process of accepting the veil, which is a necessary part of coming to be physical, I described it and shared this in other videos as well, but it's like having an obscuring limitation placed over your consciousness that's so extreme that you feel like you dive down, down, down, down, down, lower, lower, lower, lower, lower to a place where your knowing is cut off, and your connection to all things feels like it disappears. It feels like it's gone.

So you go from an extremely high vibration place—I like describing it like an amplifier that produces a pitch or something like that, and then you turn the knob, and it goes except this one, you just get to the bottom, and then you keep turning lower, lower, lower, lower, lower, more lower still, lower more. Like that's what it felt like being veiled down all the way vibrationally into this physical experience.

And when I arrived, I was overwhelmed by the fear that I immediately experienced as a response to being cut off from who I really was, being cut off from my knowing, and feeling separate from everything else. And I don't know how long I was there, but it wasn't very long because I was still in the womb when I said, "You know what? I'm not doing this. This is so dark. This is so low vibration. This is ridiculous. I'm not doing this."

And so I summoned my might, and I smoked the veil. I fought my way out, and I succeeded in doing that, but I became aware that I had killed the fetus that was to be the body that I was to live in. And I had a life review for that very, very short life, and I became aware—I knew in detail how I had made the mother's journey more difficult, and not only the poor mother, but hundreds of other people, like ripples away from the mother.

I was aware that there were hundreds of other people whose journeys had been made more difficult because of my fear right at the beginning. And I had so many good intentions going into this, so when I saw this and knew this, I thought, "Oh, I really gotta work on this." Like, I couldn't believe it, in a sense. It's hard to describe this because, from that state of being, you know that all is well. There's no fundamental problem or something, but still, I saw what I was and what I had done.

Yeah, and I really wanted to do better. So I spent some time in what I can only describe as a veil acceptance simulator. It's like a room where you go, and they put a mock veil over you, and you practice surrendering to it. It's like going into a dark pool where you go deep underwater, and then you see how long you can stay underwater. This is just a metaphor—see how long you can stay underwater until you cry uncle, you know, and then they let you out because it's just a simulator.

It's like that, and I did that for a while, but I can tell you the real thing is more difficult than the simulator. Anyway, after this experience, they brought me this life, and I reviewed this life, and I knew that it was good. It was not as good as the first one would have been, but it was still good. It was just good. It wasn't perfect.

And I remember reviewing what I can only describe as a vast flowchart of millions and millions of possibilities of how things might unfold in this life and probably would or probably wouldn't unfold. Like, if you lay a tree on its side, and the trunk is thick at the place where you start, and then it kind of goes out to branches, it was kind of like that, except it was millions and millions of possibilities as to what might happen, what would likely happen.

And there was a certain energetic trajectory that this life had, and I knew that after my 20s, I would end up in an energetic place that was further than I'd ever gone before in a certain direction. And I also knew that in my 20s, I would very likely be traumatized significantly by a certain experience, and that did happen.

So I reviewed all this, and I was filled with excitement. I think the overarching emotion that I can describe in this whole process is excitement—excitement of the opportunity to be this and do this, and also excitement because the opportunity to be human is so precious. It was like being given the most precious gift in the universe—the opportunity to be this, to do this, when there's only so many slots, you know? There's only so many open opportunities, and there's way more spirits than there are opportunities.

So being offered an opportunity to be human is just such an honor in itself. So I reviewed this life, and I remember there having to be a moment to accept it, and I don't remember that moment, but I do remember a waiting period after that where I was in this in-between place, and I was still timeless.

And I remember the guides suddenly coming to me and grabbing my attention, like, "Go now, like right now," not rude, but almost rude, like they had to grab me and really shake me out of the state I was in to kind of get me to enter Earth time at the right window or something. And the next moment, I was with these beings that I can only describe as technicians or tinkerers—that's the best English word I can think of that kind of describes the energy of what they are.

And they're like technical in nature, and for me, they did this thing where they help apply the veil to you. They match because the soul has certain rich, complex qualities, and the life has its own thing going on, and they do this thing in the body, and they make it all jive and make it all fit.

And they had this prepared, and I remember being in this place that can only be described as like a room with like a shaft, and I remember them saying one last time, "Are you sure? Are you sure you want to do this?" Because I knew that once I said yes here, that was it. I was in for the ride. I was strapped in.

And I said, "Yes." And so then the veil came over me again, and as the veil came over me this time, I focused. I got so all my energy was gathered, and the veil came over me, and I focused completely on just not fighting it, just basically letting the veil do what it will do to take hold of me, like letting it take hold within my being, within the body of my consciousness.

And I remember the plummet again—lower, lower, lower, lower, lower, even lower—and having my knowing cut off and feeling all of a sudden very alone and in the dark. And holding on and holding on and holding on and holding on, and then eventually sending a message back through there's like this little window that was still open, and I sent this little message back through to the technicians, "Did it take?" And getting one message back, "Yes."

And so I knew that I was there. So then I was in the womb, and it was okay for a while, and then eventually I said, "You know what? I'm not doing this. I'm not doing this. I'm not doing it. This is so dark. This is so low vibration. I am not going to tolerate this." I couldn't believe the breathtaking lowness of the vibration of this state, this goalful state, in comparison to where I had been.

So I began to summon my might to fight my way out again, and as I did that, this most holy moment happened for me where what I can only describe as the spirit of God came to me, and it showed me what I really still was and what I really still am and what we are. And I saw the stars and the whole universe and all things, and they were in me, and I was of them, and it was bliss.

And I felt the churning of the sun and the bliss of the turning of the sun, and the spirit said to me—God said to me, whatever word we want to use, Source—"This is still what you are. You can never not be this."

So it's hard for me to think about because I miss it so much. I'm happy to be here. I'm proud, you know, in a sense of pride, but I'm honored to be here. I don't mean to make light of the opportunity, but I miss that state so much.

But anyway, so after this moment, I was calm because I was like, "Oh, that's really what I am. Okay, oh, that's wonderful." So I let go into the simple existence of being in the womb, and the next memory I have is of being born.

I only have one visual image memory of being born. I remember seeing the room after they had pulled me out, and years later, I drew the room from my mother. I said, "You were here. Here was the doctor. Here was the heating grate. Here was the window." I remembered it, and she said I was right. I mean, I knew I would be, but just that one visual memory.

But the memory is more about the shock and the intense curiosity that I remember having right after I was born. I remember this overload of sensory data—sight and sound and touching and cold—but there was no context for it. I hadn't—I did not understand at all what was happening. I just knew things were happening, and I knew that these people around me, the nurses or whatever, I knew they were beings, and they were taking care of me somehow, but I didn't know. I couldn't conceive it. There was no conceptual understanding of what was happening, but I remember feeling love for those beings.

And I remember being so curious and just looking around like, "What is this place? Where am I? Where am I?" And yeah, so it was just very intense. So I don't have any memories after that for some number of years, but as I grew, I remember expecting certain things that were true in the other realities would be true here.

For instance, I remember expecting that we would be able to feel each other's emotions here because, in other reality systems, it's very normal for beings to be able to share their feelings and share who they really are. And so, I remember being young enough that I was in a diaper, and my parents had a neighbor friend over, and I remember this record being on a record player, and there was music playing.

And I remember telling the neighbor friend, "Watch me dance," and then standing at the couch and shaking my little tush, and I remember she just walked away unimpressed, and I was like, "What? What is going on?" Because it occurred to me that she couldn't feel what I was feeling. And when I realized that, I thought, "Where am I? What kind of an alien place is this that we cannot feel each other's emotions? What is going on?"

It was just dumbfounding to me. I was just shocked, like, "Where am I?" And then I had other assumptions that I assumed that even now, sometimes this crops up, and I feel like this is the way it should be, but on Earth, things are slightly different.

I remember expecting that people in positions of authority or leadership would be loving and wise because, in other systems, the beings who were in roles of authority or guidance were loving and wise. So I assumed here on Earth, if you were like a teacher of a classroom, you must be loving and wise, and if you were the mayor of a city, you must be really loving and wise, and if you were the president of the United States, you must be the wisest and the most loving person there is.

Well, that's not how it works on Earth—not always the case, not always the case here. So I feel like I've always had to kind of come to terms with the nature of this experience. But in this pre-birth review, I remember asking to have a small amount of memory this time, very small, and I remember them saying I could do that, but it would make this journey more difficult.

And I knew that that was the case because the contrast would be even greater. But I knew that even that contrast was an opportunity. I knew that that contrast was an opportunity for growth, so I agreed.

So yeah, that's a quick summary.

Luisa:
Thank you so much for sharing those remarkable experiences. I just want to ask you a few questions if that's okay.

Christian Sundberg:
Sure.

Luisa:
I just want to say real quick, I don't feel that it's remarkable, and the thing that was remarkable to me is that everyone doesn't remember. We all are far more than the human character that we are currently experiencing being, and I'm certainly in no way special. It's just something that we all do. We all know it's just part of the game here is to forget. That's part of the nature of being human, so I don't consider it remarkable, but I appreciate your kindness.

Luisa:
This is going to be one of these interviews where you preempt all my questions. It happens to me a lot lately. So, the veil—why is the veil put on us, in your opinion?

Christian Sundberg:
Well, there are a few important reasons, but first of all, say that if you weren't veiled, you would be the unveiled you—the whole you, the you that knows actively and feels actively that you are connected to all things and that you are one with all and that the universe is in you and you in it. And you would feel and know tangibly much, much more than just what's in front of you.

So, in order to have the experience of being human and being this human character—getting up in the morning, driving through traffic, going to work, eating your breakfast, and all that—if you were to focus on being that and having the experience of that, the veil is actually very helpful, even necessary, so that we can be that perspective.

Because there's an incredible value to having the experience of being that perspective. We come to have that perspective, and here on Earth, we tend to think that the state of separation—being separate from one another—is normal. It's not the normal state. The normal state is connectedness and knowing our unity, and this is actually a rather extreme and alien type of experience that we come to by comparison.

I mean, to know separation—so if you really want to know what it's like to be separate and to have to bring the love of what we are here into this separation, into this context, the only way to do so is to be veiled.

Being veiled is also helpful in that we tend to develop—because we have fear—unevolvingness is another word we could use for fear. We have fear, so in previous lives, we tend to get stuck in ego patterns—beliefs or certain kinds of hang-ups that can get firmed up over life, and the veil allows us to have a new personality that is free of much of that.

I mean, there are certainly elements that traverse experience to experience, but for a given life, it can be helpful to be veiled and to have a fresh start. It's still the same you, still the same experience—it's not a different person—but now you have a fresh start.

And also, it's helpful because it prevents us from having really significant homesickness. Because if you knew all of what we are and where we come from, oh my gosh, just getting through your day would be almost impossible because the yearning to be there, to go there, and to enjoy the depths of being that are possible in those higher realms would be overwhelming.

Whereas now, here we are—I don't want to use the word "blissfully ignorant," but we're able to be shielded so that we can focus on being a creature, having the experience of creaturehood, you know, biological.

Luisa:
I've often been asked the question, and I'm sure you have as well, if we're in such a high vibrational state over there—I'm just going to call it "over there," the different realm, the different dimension, heaven—there's many names for it—why do we need to come to human form to experience suffering, pain, the veil?

Christian Sundberg:
So, it's not really a need because I will say very strongly, at least in my experience, I feel strongly that all incarnation is done out of free will choice. There is no such thing as, in my opinion, being forced to incarnate.

And the reason—and I just want to say that first because that's important—because the spirit itself is sovereign. Consciousness is like you're of Source. There is no greater level of authority or something. You're a part of it. So the only way to be obscured to all of what you really are is to volunteer to do so, to allow yourself to be veiled.

So why do we do that? That's your question. So, okay, this is really hard to describe, but I'm going to give it a shot.

Luisa:
You're doing an amazing job.

Christian Sundberg:
Thank you. It's really intimidating because I feel like every time I open my mouth, I'm just wrong. There's just no words for any of this, so it's like—anyway, okay.

So, there is an important process happening, which I will simply describe as evolution or expansion. And what is it? The expansion of what is—the capital W and a capital I—and it's the expansion of joy and love.

Okay, so Source is like a sun or a ball of light, and it's the origin, and what we really are—imagine if, as a part of it, you can go vibrationally, I don't know, this far or maybe this far, maybe even this far away. If you can be there and fully integrate that experience and allow your loving true nature to actualize there and to be present there, then there's this expansion that takes place of being—not just you but the whole because you are a part of the whole.

So, this expansion that's possible is tremendous. When we talk about the opportunities on Earth, Earth is such a high-opportunity place. It is so precious in the extremity of potential that is available to us in that expansive process.

And so, we're serving not only ourselves—I'm not saying it's about serving ourselves; I'm just using these words—we're not only serving ourselves by doing it, we're serving the whole by participating because even just by being, just you and having your preferences, your experience, your perspective, and your contrast, that is additive. It is a helpful creation of perspective that is useful within the whole, within all that is.

So we do it for the expansion of love and joy, and that is a service. And we also do it because we are beings of fun and joy and creativity, and there is a remarkable amount of creative experiential creativity that is possible when we come and have the experience of being physical or being human.

Because this is such an extreme environment—the biological Earth world—it's such an extreme environment because of that, when creativity can express here, it is also remarkable in how that can—I don't know how to describe this—it's not just the creativity in the local sense; it's creativity in the spiritual sense.

Like, a small creation on Earth might be a tremendous, huge creation in other reality systems and higher systems that are thought-responsive. And in that way, we are participating in a much bigger creative process than what we visually see in front of our eyes.

So those are just two comments.

Luisa:
Knowing how that was great in the whole multi-dimensional realm, and it was explained very well because often we, as humans, say, "Well, what's in it for me? What am I getting out of it?" But when we realize that when we heal ourselves or when we heal other people, we're actually healing the collective consciousness or enhancing the collective consciousness.

Christian Sundberg:
Yes, I want to say one other reason, and that is that we are beings of love. Love is what we are. Okay, if there's nothing else that we take away from this conversation, I hope that whoever is listening would be reminded that you are loved. You are loved deeply, so deeply loved that you would be brought to your knees if you knew even the tiniest fraction of the unbelievable, powerful, universe-shattering love that there is for you.

Okay, so that much love is what we are and more. And then, when our friends and family—our brothers and sisters—are coming to be physical, one of the reasons we come then is because they've come, and we want to help and participate in that process with them and for them too.

So, the reasons for incarnation may be very specific to an individual, and I'm just saying that one of those reasons is the service of other people. It may be that someone comes just to be a friend to someone who they know from ancient, many other experiences that they want to help in some way, or we might come to fulfill some role for somebody else.

There may be somebody who wants to experience a very specific thing, and we come to be the parent or the brother or sister or whatever that will help them have that experience. So we do it out of service too.

Luisa:
Beautifully explained. This is a hard one for you, and I know it's hard to put into words: What does home feel like?

Christian Sundberg:
Oh, man. If I fought too hard on it, I would cry.

Luisa:
It's okay to cry. People cry. I cry all the time.

Christian Sundberg:
Oh, yeah. So, I think if the listener pictures home and the feeling that their home is home—their truest home, who they really are, and where they really belong—take that feeling and magnify it by a thousand or more, maybe a million. And that belongingness, that naturalness, that connectedness, that acceptance is what we are.

And home is not just a place. You know, we like to think about reality as being places—so we're here, and there must be this other place that's home, and we're in a place. It's okay to think of it like that while we're human, but environment places arise within that which is—that which is being, this life itself with a capital L, spirit, consciousness, whatever word we want to use.

What we really are has no—it can't be described, and within that arises many reality systems of rich complexity and many rules. And I'm just saying that in the context of this question because home can mean different things to different people. There are many higher realms, and I won't get into that.

Oh, I wasn't—I just know that there are higher realms, and they can be experienced through out-of-body experiences and others. And so, when we talk about home, we may be talking about a heavenly reality system; we may be talking about even higher states. You know, there's a lot to that. It's like the afterlife is not just one place. It's an extremely rich, complex, multi-layered, extremely deep multiverse.

You know, and Earth is just the tiniest, tiniest, tiniest little corner of one reality system. But anyway, so back to your original question: Home is what we are. You know, we are beingness that knows no bounds. We are love that has no limitation. We are freedom. We are joy. We are limitless. We are acceptance. We are expression of all good things—creativity. We are color and sound and poetry. We are the wind. We are the bark on the tree. We are more than this, and that's the beauty.

Is that we never leave home, put it that way. Like, we get really, really deep into the physical experience—very deep. That's the nature of being human—like, how deep, how extreme can we go into denseness and separation? We are testing the boundaries of that right now. But even as we do that, we could say metaphorically, we never leave.

It's metaphorically like we fall asleep in heaven to have the dream of being physical. This reality, as real as it is, is a real experience, but the physical is like the dream. And when the physical is relinquished and let go, the higher realms, the higher states of being, are far more real and rich and beyond any earthly description. This place is like the black-and-white movie by comparison.

Luisa:
Is there a point—well, there's no time—is there a point after multiple and multiple reincarnations that we no longer need to come back to the physical form or no longer—not need, but choose?

Christian Sundberg:
Yeah, I imagine that there's probably—I don't know for certain, but I feel that it's very likely that eventually, this form of expansion and expression will be one that we choose to not pursue further. But because the nature of the physical experience is so rich and high-contrast, there is so much potential here that it is common for individuals to—I don't want to say "get stuck" because it's not really stuck—but for individuals to process more than one experience.

Luisa:
Well, there's so many probabilities, aren't there?

Christian Sundberg:
There are.

Luisa:
Do you think we can be living multiple realities at the same time?

Christian Sundberg:
Yes, yeah. The soul is—so, metaphorically, if this is like playing a video game—this is just a metaphor—but if you're sitting down at the computer playing a game, the soul is not limited to playing one game. It can play multiple computers at the same time—something like that.

Luisa:
Yeah, like parallel timelines. Is that, in your opinion, based on the choices that we make—free will—that lead us in another direction or another timeline?

Christian Sundberg:
So, I feel that timelines are—I feel that my current understanding is that there are actualized timelines and unactualized timelines. And to borrow some terms from Tom Campbell, the physicist and consciousness explorer who I'm a big fan of—he's an awesome man—he describes a database in the spirit where it records all actualized paths and many, many, many unactualized paths—billions upon billions upon billions of unactualized paths.

And those unactualized paths can then go be experienced, and like a computer—this is again just a metaphor—but like a computer, the system can take a screenshot of any one of those unactualized paths and reload it and have new players assigned to it. So, anyway, I'm just putting that in context because I think it's a rather complex system.

It's hard to nail down from here, but yes, our free will choices are constantly taking us down different avenues. Like, in my pre-birth experience, when I reviewed the flowchart of what this life could be like or would be like, the factor which made the probabilities higher or lower was free will. It was my choices and the choices of every other participant because they're like—so there's like these energetic seasons or movements that happen through the species even, and those movements affect the context of the play.

Like, there might be an overarching theme of a given place that has an effect on the choices that people are making there, and all that ties together, and it seems to us as humans ridiculously complex—like trillions upon trillions upon trillions upon trillions of infinite voices, yeah, basically infinite. But to spirit, the spirit has—to use another Tom Campbell term—a huge amount of processing power, infinite knowledge. It is no problem processing all these probabilities, so it can predict ahead of time what is likely to happen.

And then, here's an important thing: This physical experience is a novel experience, meaning that the choices that are being made are affecting outcomes in ways that might be unanticipated. And that is a part of the incredible value actually of the human experience—that things happen that were not anticipated, and it, for lack of a better word, forces other avenues. And in the end, that process is ultimately creative.

And that's important too—not to get down another tangent—but it just reminds me of how we see destruction around us, right? Sometimes things get destroyed; people die; people get sick; natural disasters happen. And it's hard for us to see past the loss and the destruction, but that is a part of the creativity possible on that that is not otherwise possible.

Luisa:
So, when you saw the spreadsheet or the pre-plan of your life or the main trajectories of your life, did you see all the way up until you return to the non-physical—the main highways that may occur or the most likely probability of what will happen?

Christian Sundberg:
Yes, yeah. I even reviewed it in terms of numerical ages. I remember knowing it would probably be 22 or 23 where I would have my trauma, and that did happen when I was 22. I am currently aware of a potential exit point that I won't discuss. I don't know if it's going to happen or not, but I remember knowing that past my early 30s, I would be so far down this certain energetic trajectory that it would be hard to see.

I don't know—I mean, that's not the right word—not hard to see, but it would be the branches were thinner and more difficult to nail down, and that's where I am now. Like, I feel right now like I am very far out in the wilderness in a certain direction, and I actually have a yearning to decompress—not that I want to say die, I'm going to physically die—but when this journey is over, I look forward to a life review and to basically process everything I've experienced thus far.

Luisa:
Can I ask what the fear was that you had to—that you requested to relearn in this lifetime?

Christian Sundberg:
Yeah, yeah. Okay, so when we think about fear, we tend to think of a fear of something—you know, like a fear of heights or something—and that's okay. But I'm using fear in a deeper sense, and it's more like a vibrational distance from Source.

So, in my case, the fear can best be described as the inability—the perception of inability—to escape agony mixed with being too proud to suffer. And I had an experience in China. I tried to move to China after college because I had studied in ATM when I was 20, and I had an experience when I was 22 where I had a heat stroke, and I was in a Chinese hospital for four days, and they gave me bag after bag after bag of potassium, and it fried my nervous system somehow.

And that's one thing I'll just mention that in my pre-birth experience, I was aware that this body has certain biological limitations that other bodies do not, and I knew it would make my journey more difficult and it would push me in some extreme directions in my experience.

So, I had this traumatic experience, and you know, I was forced to face and feel what ultimately was the fear of being unable to escape pain and being too proud to accept that I was in this state. And I had—I saw this—this was an extremely physically painful whatever happened to me. It lasted for months. My body did not sweat for 10 months. I was in constant physical pain.

And after weeks of this, I had kind of—I like, I became traumatized. I had post-traumatic stress disorder for about eight years, and I could not even remember my life before the age of 22 very well at all. My psyche blocked off—that's kind of a normal thing in post-traumatic experience.

So, I went through years of counseling, and through that—through EMDR therapy is what it was called—and through a very skilled practitioner, I did experience layer after layer after layer, deeper and deeper, towards the sphere. And eventually, after years, it did re-meet the actual deepest fear that I'm here to feel, and it was breathtakingly low vibration.

But I am no longer—I don't need to resist it as the fear arises and as the experience manifests in whatever way it will. I accept it as it arises. I choose not to resist reality. Reality is not my enemy. My experience is not my enemy, and I know that there is profound value in facing whatever I feel.

And at the time, I did not have my pre-birth memory available to me, so it was quite terrifying. It was only after processing the fear to a great depth that the memory began to return. And so now, it's inspirationally helpful for me because now I remember, "Oh, that's fine. I'm meant to be dealing with this." And meant to be dealing with this is helpful, you know, and I can feel that it's helpful in ways.

And it's not something I can even do all at once. I don't think—I don't know. I guess I won't put any limits on it. I just know that I have taken very important steps so far in integrating this type of experience.

Luisa:
What would you say to people that are afraid of dying?

Christian Sundberg:
Okay, well, there is no death. Okay, I know that it looks like there's death because bodies deteriorate and cease to function, you know, but there is no death. And in fact, death is the most wonderful thing because it is not just not an end; it is actually a freedom, a release, a removal of constraints.

This state of being human is the more dead state. I'm not speaking negatively or against this precious experience of being human, but this is the far more limited and difficult state. Death is a release. It's like taking off a heavy spacesuit or a very tight shirt or climbing out of a small metal can or something and expanding back to incredible breath and freedom and joy.

And that is a most almost wonderful process. It's something that I very much look forward to. I'm not wishing to die, but I relate to near-death experiencers who speak about yearning to go home. And there's nothing terrible about that. It is a wonderful, wonderful thing. It is a release and a freedom, not an end. No, the end is an illusion.

Luisa:
That's very comforting. Do we have a little bit of time to speak about your out-of-body experiences?

Christian Sundberg:
Sure. So, that's why I consider myself a neophyte in that arena, but I have had a few experiences. I'll just stay at a high level.

So, I've had experiences where, from a meditative state, I am non-local. So, I am not me as a body; I am everywhere, and that is blissful and wonderful. I've had experiences where my body sleeps, and I am fully lucid and conscious in some other environment—whether it be like this local world.

I've had one experience—only one—where I was walking around my house, but I didn't know I was out of body because it was so normal and so real. And I was feeling the carpet under my toes and the cracks on the walls. It took me a while to figure out that I was not in my body until I walked through a wall. I couldn't figure it out.

I've had experiences in other reality systems that are so beautiful—just so beautiful that the light is alive, and the color is living and engenders things like each color is an embodiment of some quality, and it speaks to you, and you can revel in it.

Like, this one experience I had, I was just looking at the grass, and the grass was so green that I felt like I could look at this grass all day and not get bored because it's so beautiful and so rich. I could just look; I could just revel in the beauty of the green alone. But the whole environment was beautiful.

I've also had some experiences where I've been able to interact with people that I know physically in this life who are alive right now, and I've had four experiences where I've been able to confirm that interaction the next day. I think that's a fun activity to try to do—interact with people and confirm it.

But all in all, I mean, I'm a newbie when it comes to those types of experiences. They arise as they arise. I think that's something that's worth mentioning to anyone who's interested in this topic is that I found that in my case, meditation was the most powerful and helpful—I don't want to use the word "activity" because it's actually not an activity—but activity that I ever pursued.

Because as you become increasingly familiar with what you really are—which is awareness itself—versus what you're not—which is your thoughts and your identification with form—and that's not really what you are—as you become increasingly familiar and in touch with the awareness that you really are, other parts of you will rise up to you on their own.

So, out-of-body experiences just happen naturally because we aren't the body. It's not like a super rare, mystical thing when you begin to get in touch with the awareness that you really are, and then it becomes much more natural.

So, I think that out-of-body experiences are incredibly fun, but I also have felt called to focus physically, so I have really been focusing on doing the mundane, day-to-day thing and doing what I can while I'm here. But when the experiences arise, that's wonderful. Embrace them.

Luisa:
Embrace them, yeah, and don't be afraid.

Christian Sundberg:
Yeah, and don't be afraid. That's the thing. These experiences can be extremely—I mean, they are extremely real, and they can be extremely fear-provoking because, like, the first time—so, the first non-physical experience I ever had after beginning to meditate, I was sleeping, and I was in a normal dream, and I was dreaming that I was about to be hit by a wave, and it was going to kill me.

And this wave crashed into me, and I told myself in the dream, "Okay, you're dying now. Let go. Let go of your body." And as I thought that, suddenly I woke up, but my body wasn't awake, but I was awake, and I was experiencing the most loud—like a jet engine on either side of my head—and this vibration going through my whole body and my whole being that was so violent. It was just so extreme and so loud.

And I was stuck there for I don't know—maybe 10 or 15 seconds—and when I woke up, I actually physically jumped out of my bed, and I was shaking. Yeah, it is—how could I know that? How is that experience possible? And so now, when an experience like that happens, I still strive to not react in fear—just allow what may happen.

Luisa:
That's great. And just briefly, you talked before about how, on this physical plane, we don't read each other's emotions—or not many of us read others' emotions. I think we actually do, but we kind of hide it or dull it. But I've also spoken to you about how you can feel people. Do you mind just discussing that briefly?

Christian Sundberg:
Yeah, I mean, I'll just say that, especially when I'm in a more meditated place—when I am not associated as deeply with the demands of earthly life—I tend to feel the nature of individuals that I interact with like in my body, like as a vibration.

And I think, like you said, we don't really lose that because we really are consciousness. We really are connected. Separation is the illusion. Okay, so there really is still a connection, which means we really can still have telepathy. In fact, we are communicating with each other all the time, even if we're not consciously aware of it. All the information is there.

So, the higher parts of us are always interacting anyway, but as we become more in touch with deeper parts of ourselves, it can be natural then to also experience parts of the other. Like, as just an example, I was in a gaming store one day, and I was playing a game on a table, and this old woman walked in.

And I felt her all of a sudden, and I looked over, and my breath was kind of taken away because she looked physically like this meek old woman who was unexceptional—you know, very ordinary—but who she really was was powerful and profound and amazing. And I was just like, I wanted to just walk over and grab her by the shoulders and say, "Do you know who you are?"

But I couldn't—that would be strange.

Luisa:
I want to be that guy.

Christian Sundberg:
Yeah, so I do feel that sometimes, you know, just at least to some extent. And I try to remain skeptical as well. You know, I'm a—I try to remain both open-minded and skeptical and just see what data is there. You know, there's another term—data. See what information, see what I'm experiencing, and just try to evaluate it.

But yeah, I have found that I do experience things that other people do not. I've always been very sensitive. I'm sensitive both to physical stimulus and also non-physical stimulus. I can feel certain energies—like, if I hold a crystal, I can feel the difference.

You know, I'm sensitive to smells and sounds and motion. You know, traveling can be very difficult for me when I'm going through a lot of different places very quickly. It's just a lot on my energy. I don't know. So yeah, that's part of my experience.

Luisa:
Well, it's very interesting. Thank you, Christian. It's been such a delight to have you on Passion Harvest. Is there something you'd like to talk to the Passion Harvest audience that I haven't asked since I've asked all the questions?

Christian Sundberg:
Sure, yeah. I just want to say to whoever's listening, I want to say that who you really are is so wonderful and profoundly beautiful and free and full of love that I want you to be encouraged—whoever you are listening—to not feel overwhelmed by all the circumstances of your life that you may be identifying with.

What we are is far more than the human character. Who you are listening—you, the you that's listening—is you. And what I mean by that is you are the you that feels like you to you. You are the you that is most you that you know. And that precious you—just you may think that you are the problems, and you are the name, and you are the sex, and you are the body, but you are far more.

And so, I'm honored and humbled to at least be able to remind you in some small part of that because, in who we really are, there's freedom, and there is ultimately nothing to fear. This is the place we come to experience here for the purposes I described earlier, but there is no true reason to ever be afraid. There is no true loss. There is no death. There is no actual defeat or failure.

There is the experience of being human, the meaning that we place upon it, and there is such a rich opportunity in that. So, I hope to remind whoever you are listening that you are a powerful being and that you do not need to be afraid.

Luisa:
What a beautiful message, Christian. Thank you so much for spreading your light in the world. All your details will be in the show notes, but where's the best place for people to connect with you?

Christian Sundberg:
I have a spiritual blog. It's www.awalkinthephysical.com, and I'm also going to be publishing a book later this year.

Luisa:
Congratulations.

Christian Sundberg:
Thank you. I'm working on it, and anybody who would like to talk, I'm available on Facebook. Just look me up. I'm happy to speak to anybody who would like to speak.

This is an awesome opportunity to be able to connect in the physical while we are here. We have all come a very long way, so it's my honor to speak to whoever here this day, this moment, because it's just an awesome thing that we've done to come this far. I'm honored to be able to do that, so please reach out if you'd like.

Luisa:
Great. Well, Christian Sundberg, thank you so much for being on Passion Harvest. It's been a very insightful and high-vibrational interview.

Christian Sundberg:
Thank you.

Luisa:
Bye-bye.

Christian Sundberg:
Thank you too.

Luisa:
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